This in depth writing you're doing is really difficult and is a immense service to skaters in this country at least. Skatepark design is in somewhat of an arrested development here. In this era of landscape design being entirely uninterested in the plaza styles where skateboarding incidentally thrived (re: Love and Muni getting greened up), its really important that we as skaters take stock in very fine detail of what actually makes a great space for skateboarding. Its about park scaled compositions that function well and are made up of very minute and interrelated details. Cogently switching between those scales is difficult in conversation and in writing. I think you're doing a great job of breaking it all up. Its an immense challenge.
You're absolutely right that the cultural component has evolved since Skater's Island and skatepark design in many ways has not. Having grown up skating almost exclusively street and then working for Breaking Ground Skateparks, a design/build/ skate ethos grown out of Burnside, I have learned a lot in straddling those two sects within skating (there's pages I could write about the coping debates but I will hold off for future posts).
That 'older ethic' that lead to conflict over bike pegs is central to the arrested development of current skatepark design but that conflict is still grounded in a material disfunction. For the most part I think the effects of urethane and aluminum and plywood on the cityscape is unsightly but ultimately can be defined as "use" rather than damage. Whereas steel pegs cause a lot more of cracking, chipping and breaking, which skaters are often blamed for as BMX bikes are never a municipally banned activity. I have experienced it in the disappointment of losing ledge spots to damage but also the frustration in fielding complaints from city officials whom I've been lobbying for better skateparks. I think that this distinction remains important for design/ build conversations despite progress in cultural overlap.
But yeah all that to say:
Yes! I too would love to experience more granite and concrete ledge grinds in skateparks. This page rules. Looking forward to what you write next
Agree with all the observations and conclusions around ideal ledge dimensions (maybe the runup dimensions are a bit excessive especially for the spatially constrained northeast?).
Just want to lend additional context to the tragically exclusive use of steel in skatepark ledges:
bike pegs.
While a variety of concrete and stone products can withstand years of aluminum truck contact, they quickly chip and degrade when met with the heavier and harder force of steel bmx pegs. Skateparks have long been a site of conflict over material experiences and uses. As far back as 20 years ago at the late Skater's Island, the snake run section featured prominent signage; "NO PEGS ON POOL COPING".
Very knowledgeable.
Hi Dave,
This in depth writing you're doing is really difficult and is a immense service to skaters in this country at least. Skatepark design is in somewhat of an arrested development here. In this era of landscape design being entirely uninterested in the plaza styles where skateboarding incidentally thrived (re: Love and Muni getting greened up), its really important that we as skaters take stock in very fine detail of what actually makes a great space for skateboarding. Its about park scaled compositions that function well and are made up of very minute and interrelated details. Cogently switching between those scales is difficult in conversation and in writing. I think you're doing a great job of breaking it all up. Its an immense challenge.
You're absolutely right that the cultural component has evolved since Skater's Island and skatepark design in many ways has not. Having grown up skating almost exclusively street and then working for Breaking Ground Skateparks, a design/build/ skate ethos grown out of Burnside, I have learned a lot in straddling those two sects within skating (there's pages I could write about the coping debates but I will hold off for future posts).
That 'older ethic' that lead to conflict over bike pegs is central to the arrested development of current skatepark design but that conflict is still grounded in a material disfunction. For the most part I think the effects of urethane and aluminum and plywood on the cityscape is unsightly but ultimately can be defined as "use" rather than damage. Whereas steel pegs cause a lot more of cracking, chipping and breaking, which skaters are often blamed for as BMX bikes are never a municipally banned activity. I have experienced it in the disappointment of losing ledge spots to damage but also the frustration in fielding complaints from city officials whom I've been lobbying for better skateparks. I think that this distinction remains important for design/ build conversations despite progress in cultural overlap.
But yeah all that to say:
Yes! I too would love to experience more granite and concrete ledge grinds in skateparks. This page rules. Looking forward to what you write next
Agree with all the observations and conclusions around ideal ledge dimensions (maybe the runup dimensions are a bit excessive especially for the spatially constrained northeast?).
Just want to lend additional context to the tragically exclusive use of steel in skatepark ledges:
bike pegs.
While a variety of concrete and stone products can withstand years of aluminum truck contact, they quickly chip and degrade when met with the heavier and harder force of steel bmx pegs. Skateparks have long been a site of conflict over material experiences and uses. As far back as 20 years ago at the late Skater's Island, the snake run section featured prominent signage; "NO PEGS ON POOL COPING".
Where we're at with ledges is no different.